SAYIN BAKANIMIZIN BELÇİKA BAŞBAKAN YARDIMCISI VE DIŞİŞLERİ BAKANI STEVEN VANACKERE İLE ORTAK BASIN TOPLANTISI

(Ankara, 10 Ağustos 2010)

(Tercümede yaşanan aksaklık nedeniyle, salon sesi deşifre edilmiştir.)

SAYIN BAKANIMIZ: Değerli basın mensupları, bugün çok değerli bir meslektaşımı, bir arkadaşımı Ankara’da ağırlamaktan memnunluk duyuyorum. Belçika Başbakan Yardımcısı ve Dışişleri Bakanı Sayın Steven Vanackere davetimize icabetle ülkemizi ziyaret ediyorlar. Dün Sayın Başbakanımızla birlikte görüşmüştük, bugün sabah da çok kapsamlı, bir ikili görüşme gerçekleştirdik. İstişare ettiğimiz konuları üç ana başlık altında toplayabiliriz. Birincisi ikili ilişkiler, ikincisi, Belçika’nın AB Dönem Başkanı olması hasebiyle özellikle, Türkiye-AB ilişkileri, üçüncüsü de bölgesel ve uluslararası konular.

İkili ilişkiler çerçevesine baktığımızda Türkiye-Belçika ilişkileri gerçekten çok köklü bir geçmişe sahip, dostluk ilişkileridir ve üst düzey diyalogumuz kesintisiz devam etmiştir. Belçika Başbakanı Sayın  Leterme’nin 29-30 Aralık 2009’da yaptığı ziyarette çok kapsamlı görüşmeler zaten gerçekleştirilmişti. Biz bu ikili siyasi diyaloğun daha da geliştirilerek sürdürülmesini istiyoruz. Bu çerçevede majesteleri Kral II. Albert’i Türkiye’de ağırlamaktan da büyük bir mutluluk duyacağız.

Diyalogumuz yanında, özellikle teröre karşı mücadele konusunu kapsamlı şekilde ele aldık ve 2008 yılında başlatılan ve iki ülke arasındaki üç Bakanın katılımıyla gerçekleşen, İçişleri Bakanları, Dışişleri Bakanları ve Adalet Bakanları arasındaki üçlü ortak toplantıların, bu sonbaharda tekrar yapılması kararını aldık. Önce üst düzey bürokratlar şeklinde toplanacağız, daha sonra da Bakanlar olarak, iki ülkenin üçer Bakanı, özellikle güvenlik ve terör konularını ele almak üzere bir araya geleceğiz.

Ben kendilerine özellikle Mart ayında terör örgütü PKK’ya karşı gerçekleştirilen operasyonlar dolayısıyla takdirlerimizi ifade ettim ve bu çerçevede yürütülen çalışmaların etkin bir şekilde devam etmesinin bizim açımızdan taşıdığı önemi bir kez daha vurguladım. Teröre karşı mücadele müttefiklerin ortak sorumluluğudur ve bu konuda birlikte çalışma kararımızı bir kez daha teyit ettik.

Ekonomik ilişkilerimizi, 2009’da biraz düşme eğilimi gösteren ticari ilişkilerimizi arttırma konusunda birlikte çalışmaya karar verdik. Biliyorsunuz 2008’de beş milyar dolar civarında olan ticaret hacmimiz 2009’da ekonomik kriz dolayısıyla 4 milyar düzeyine inmişti. Tekrar bu yıl önemli bir artış ilk 5 ayda gerçekleşti.  Ümit ediyoruz ki ticari ilişkilerimiz daha da artarak devam edecek.

Kültürel ilişkilerde özellikle Belçika’da yaşayan vatandaşlarımızın Belçika siyasi sistemine entegrasyon konusunda sağladıkları başarı çerçevesinde takdirlerimi ifade ettim. Üç Türk kökenli vatandaşımız Belçika Federal Meclisine girdi. Birçok Türk kökenli vatandaşımız da Belçika’da, gerçekten Avrupa’daki birçok ülkeye göre çok daha fazla, sosyal, siyasi ve ekonomik hayat içinde aktif rol alıyorlar.

İkinci ana başlık olarak, AB konusunda çok kapsamlı değerlendirmeler yaptık. Özellikle dost ve Türkiye’nin AB üyeliğini hep desteklemiş olan Belçika’nın Dönem Başkanlığını, Türkiye-AB ilişkilerinde önemli bir şans dönemi olarak, önemli bir fırsat dönemi olarak değerlendiriyoruz. Bizim bu konudaki stratejik tercihimizi bir kez daha kendilerine vurguladım; Türkiye, AB tam üyeliği konusunu en önemli stratejik tercih olarak benimsemiştir ve bu konuda istikametini çok net olarak belirlemiştir. Biz stratejik geleceğimizi Avrupa’da görürken, Avrupa’nın da kendi stratejik geleceğini Türkiye ile birlikte görmesini bekliyor ve bu çerçevede, Türkiye’nin AB üyeliğini sadece bir üyelik olarak değil, küresel barışa giden önemli bir aşama olarak değerlendiriyoruz.

Bu konuda önümüzdeki altı ay içinde yapılacak çalışmaları gözden geçirdik. Özellikle fasıllardaki son durumu ele aldık. Ayrıca Kıbrıs konusundaki gelişmeleri de kapsamlı bir şekilde istişare ettik. Türkiye’nin Kıbrıs konusunun kapsamlı bir çözüme kavuşturulması konusundaki kararlı siyasi iradesini bir kez daha kendilerine teyit ettim. Ancak, Kıbrıs konusundan ya da diğer siyasi engellerden hareketle, Türkiye’nin AB üyeliğinin önüne yeni engeller konmasını kabullenmeyeceğimizi de vurguladım. Nihayetinde özellikle Türkiye-AB stratejik diyaloğu konusunda önümüzdeki dönemde çok daha yakın çalışma kararlılığımızı vurguladık ve bu stratejik hedefin bir an önce gerçekleşmesi için elimizden gelen gayreti gösterme konusunda mutabık kaldık.

Üçüncü olarak bölgesel konuları, uluslararası sorunları ele aldık. Başta İran’ın nükleer programı, Ortadoğu’daki gelişmeler, Irak’taki hükümet kurma çalışmaları ve Afganistan konularını gözden geçirdik. Balkanlar konusuna da öğle yemeğinde devam edeceğiz. Bütün bu konularda Türkiye’nin bölgesel politikalarının AB stratejik hedefiyle tam uyumlu politikalar olduğunu bir kez daha kendisine vurguladım. Türkiye bölgesel politikalarıyla AB stratejik hedefini birbirini ikame eden yaklaşımlar olarak değil, birbirini bütünleyen yaklaşımlar olarak görmektedir. Önümüzdeki dönemde Belçika’nın ve değerli dostum Steven’in katkılarıyla, ümit ediyoruz ki Türkiye-AB ilişkileri yepyeni bir stratejik perspektif kazanacaktır ve bu işbirliği bölgesel ve uluslararası alanda barışa büyük katkılarda bulunacaktır.

Kendisine tekrar hoş geldiniz diyorum, Ankara kendisinin evidir, benim evim de kendisinin evidir, her zaman tekrar bekliyorum.

KONUK BAKAN:  Thank you very much. I live in Brussels and Brussels should be your home as well when you come to Brussels.

SAYIN BAKAN: It is my home.

KONUK BAKAN:  Let me start, perhaps by simply stating the obvious; I have been very much impressed by hospitality of your beautiful country.

I am not going to comment on each and every detail that Ahmet has already very extensively explained and our very frank, comprehensive discussion this morning. First of all,  when it comes to bilateral relationship today between Turkey and Belgium, I really think, as Ahmet said, that there are excellent bilateral relationships. They have also something to do, I think, with the presence of very well integrated Turkish community in my country; with perhaps the fact that about 5% of the Belgian population enjoys Turkey as a tourism destination each and every year. 1 in 20 Belgians come to your beautiful country and profit from the hospitality. I think that the people-to-people relationships are very well-developed.

It is true that we have discussed, essentially yesterday with the Turkish Prime Minister Erdoğan, about the fall back in economic trade, but let’s be fair, that has a lot to do with the crisis that hit the world and we are re-establishing our sound economic relationship and I think we have to continue with that.

One of the elements that perhaps is of some importance is that we decided together that we wanted the meeting, the very successful meeting that took place in October of 2008 between Turkish and Belgium Ministers of Foreign Affairs, of Internal Affairs-Home Affairs and Justice that we wanted this trilateral meetings to reoccur. Because we saw that it gave a lot of impetus to the cooperation as far as security, police and justice issues are concerned. And we will be trying to have at least a meeting on the high officials level as soon as possible in order to perhaps have a meeting in Ministerial level by November. At least both of us are very much convinced that this will be a fruitful way to establish clearly the ways in which we can work together bilaterally.

I also want to express a few remarks and I will be coming back to question on the visa and on the fight against terrorism. But I want to embolden this also in my double casket as the rotating  President of the European Union. You know very much that the Belgian diplomacy think it is crucial for Europe to stay within the logic of the Lisbon Treaty so I will be the rotating President, counting very much on the way of Herman Van Rompuy,  of Catherine Aston and when it comes to enlargement for example and the Commissioner Stefan Fule, with which Ahmet you have very fine relationships. And we want to be useful in this process of having rotating the Presidency establishing firm lines along the unique European view.

On  European affairs, it is clear that as the chairperson of the General Affairs Council, I will have the responsibility as far as enlargement is concerned and I do reestablish that we have a firm commitment to work for continued to progress when it comes to enlargement. I have witnessed yesterday and today in my meetings with my colleagues a firm commitment also on the Turkish side to continue progress in this matter. So it is very important to state that there is no European fatigue, and there is no Turkish skepticism which is going to lead to something useful. We want to enforce, give power to the positive convictions within our communities in order to get the European Union and Turkey closely together. And we will work very closely together to make this possible. We seek common grounds for further progress.

With regards to terrorism, I want to make it very clear; and I said it yesterday also in the presence of the Prime Minister; the quality of friendship is that when friends get hurt, we are hurt as well. And even if it is true that the fight against terrorism if a fight which has to be done on different levels, not only military, not only intelligence, not only justice but also on the political level at the sources of terrorism;  no reason can justify the use of violence and there is no justification for terrorism. And I want to state it very clearly as a representative of my country but also as a representative of the European Union, in the fight against terrorism the European Union and Belgium are alongside the Turkish government to fight against terrorism. Of course this must be done strictly respecting procedures and guarantees about human rights and that’s very true enough, but it is clear that in the fight against terrorism we are clearly allies.

As far as the visa facilitation is concerned, we have heard very clearly the voices of the Turkish colleagues about these wishes to make travel easier to the European continent. I wish to make it clear also in a somewhat bilateral meeting, that when it comes to Belgium, together with the other colleagues of Benelux, we already did some efforts on for example the visa for diplomats and for officials which goes even further than what is done in the rest of Europe. So we have a lot of good track record also when it comes to visa for business people to try to have a fast track and to make life easier. This being said when it comes to the hole policy of visa facilitation, it is clear that it is a European Union policy. And there I was very satisfied to hear that my colleague was very much voluntary when it comes to the Re-admission Agreement. You know that in my country and in the rest of Europe, the problem of illegal immigration is an important problem for my public opinion, for my people, for the people of the European Union. And everything which helps to build confidence that Turkey wants to be a partner in order to have people to people relationships but for people who has serious business to do in the place of destination. And with the Re-Admission Agreement, people who have other intentions can be easily transferred back. This would be very much confidence building and I was very happy to hear that not only as far as the agreement is concerned, but also in the implementation that there are important ambitions.

And lastly, I really think that the discussions Ahmet and myself had about the international role that Turkey can play geo-strategically with its relationships with other countries, they represent an asset for the European Union. I said it very clearly, a country looking around 360 degrees, it does exactly what is normal. Every country should do exactly that. And it is clear that having relationships with all countries, also the countries from outside the European Union, is a way for Turkey to make itself even more interesting as a partner, as a strategic partner for the European Union. We don’t have to agree each and every time. It is not necessary but we share exactly the same views on all of the subject matters. But when talking about Afghanistan, about Iraq, about the Middle East, about these issues; it is clear that a better understanding of each other’s priorities and of each other’s capacity to understand and to explain, is something of a great value. I had a very good meeting this morning, yesterday I think we had a good meeting as well with the Prime Minister. I am looking forward to have even more contacts in your beautiful country.

And by the phrase that I used in the beginning, I was truly impressed by the hospitality of your beautiful country. It is the first time that I came to Turkey. My excuse is that, as a Minister of Foreign Affairs I was only appointed about, I think, 9 or 10 months ago. And at least you can say that my first destination as the rotating President, was Turkey and I think it is a relationship well-worth investing in. And I am looking forward coming back as soon as possible and have more contacts with the representatives of the Turkish government and of the Turkish society.

Thank you very much.

SAYIN BAKAN : Biz de teşekkür ediyoruz ve bu ilk temas son olmayacak. Önümüzdeki dönemde çok daha sık görüşeceğiz. Ayrıca vize konusunu da ele almıştık, aynen diğer ülkelere uygulandığı yöntemlerle, vize muafiyet sistemi ve Geri Kabul Anlaşması’nın birlikte devreye girmesi konusunda çalışacağımızı teyit etmiştik. Bu konuya da bir kez daha açıklık getirdiğimiz için memnuniyetimi ifade etmek istiyorum.

SORU: Question for both ministers. Last weeks there was little bit of discussion between several European Union member states whether or not Turkey should be an EU member state. David Cameron came to Ankara and said that there should be no doubt that Turkey should be a member state. Point blank. The French and Germans prefer strategic partnership. So the question for both ministers now, did you sort out the point of view of the European Union as a whole? Secondly, Mr. Vanackere can you give some more explanation about the Belgian point of view because I only hear talking about strategic partnership as well.

KONUK BAKAN: When talking about strategic partnership; for me, future membership is part of the deal. I am not talking strategic partnership in an impoverished way. For me it is a rich thing. And being a strategic partner that is of course also being in line with the message that was sent to Turkey already a few years ago, isn’t it? But the destiny is to go on in the accession process and of course to take into account that this is a process which is merit-based. And Ahmet will not hold it against me, it means that every country has to do some effort as well. Efforts are in order to be able to accomplish the acquis communautaire, that is nothing exceptional we ask. We ask it of all the countries aspiring to become a member of the EU. And there is a lot of effort to be done in order to be able to prepare its economy, its society, its political processes to be full-fledged member of the EU.

Now when you speak about different voices, I don’t want to exaggerate that. If you have a need, for example at the statement of Guido Westerwelle, I am not the advocate of Guido Westerwelle, but he simply said today Turkey is not ready to accession. That is not a very very revolutionary statement, since we all know that in some chapters there is still some progress to be done. And this has nothing about the future of the process which is destined to have a positive outcome.

SAYIN BAKANIMIZ: Let me answer this in English. We have to look from the perspective of European values and principles. Until now, in the EU accession process for other countries, there was no case where a country started accession negotiation and did not end with full membership. There is only one case Norway, they voted themselves against it. So as a scientist I can say, statistics is a good guide. It means 100%, that a country starts accession negotiations, becomes a full-member. There is no exception to that. And when a country starts accession negotiation, it is not an ordinary country anymore. Not a country of partnership. Partnership means two political entities are working together as partner. In the case of Turkish-EU relations there is no partnership. There is a preparation for the full membership and therefore, in the political dialogue last month with Madam Ashton and with Mr. Fule, we discussed how Turkey and the EU with the prepared for full-membership through a strategic dialog. This is our perspective and we do not see any alternative to this vision. Turkey will be full-member. Not a partner but a member of the EU. And that will be an asset for the EU and for Turkey. Of course we will do our homework and we have been doing. But our only expectation from the EU is to implement the main procedures to Turkey like other countries. Nothing more, nothing less together as partners.

SORU: Sayın Bakanım benim sorum size olacak. Mavi Marmara gemisine baskın düzenleyen İsrail, ülkesinde yaptığı soruşturmada İsrail Başbakanı’nı dinledi ve İsrail Başbakanı Türk Hükümetini bu saldırıdan sorumlu tuttu. Buna yönelik bir değerlendirmeniz olacak mı? Teşekkür ederim.

SAYIN BAKANIMIZ: Tabii şu anda BM Genel Sekreteri’nin girişimiyle bir uluslararası komisyon oluşturuldu ve bu komisyon bugün itibariyle ön çalışmalarına başlıyor. Bu komisyonunun çalışmalarının neticesini herkesin beklemesi lazım. BM Güvenlik Konseyi’nin yaptığı Başkanlık açıklamasına istinaden BM Genel Sekreteri’nin bu komisyonu oluşturması çok önemli bir adımdır. Zaten bu konuda BM Genel Sekreteri de Sayın Netanyahu’nun açıklamalarına gereken cevabı dün verdi. Bu komisyon tarafsız bir şekilde bütün bu konuları detaylı inceleyecektir. Hiç kimse uluslararası sularda sivillerin öldürülmüş olmasının sorumluluğunu başka bir tarafa yükleyemez. Çok açık bir durum vardır, uluslararası sularda İsrail sivilleri öldürmüştür. Her şeyden önce bunun sorumluluğunu üstlenmeleri gerekir. Ancak biz uluslararası komisyonun bu konuda yapacağı çalışmalara güveniyoruz ve bunun neticesinde uluslararası hukuka uygun bir şekilde sorumlularının belirleneceğine de inanıyoruz. Bu konuda Türkiye’nin hiçbir sorumluluğu sözkonusu değildir. Türkiye kendi vatandaşlarının hukukunu da korumaya kararlıdır.

KONUK BAKAN: Perhaps one or two phrases. Immediately after the regrettable incident Belgium has regretted the disproportionate use of force in this action. And we demanded immediately to have an independent and international inquiry into the exact circumstances of this incident. We are very pleased to see that Mr. Ban Ki-moon, I think with an agreement with the State of Israel and Turkey, came to an agreement upon the establishment of a commission of an independent international inquiry. And, as my colleague Ahmet has already said, we need to wait to see the results of that inquiry before making final judgments.

SORU: Görüşmede terör konusunu ele aldığınızı söylediniz. Peki Fehriye Erdal’ın iadesi konusunu görüştünüz mü? Bu konuda bir gelişme var mı? Her iki Bakana da soruyorum, Özelikle yıllardan beri Türkiye iadesini istiyor, Belçika iade etmiyor.Bbu konu gündeme geldi mi?

SAYIN BAKANIMIZ: Bu konuyu da tabii detaylı olarak ele aldık. Bu konuda Türkiye’nin beklentilerini her zaman olduğu gibi en açık bir şekilde muhatabımıza, gerek dün Sayın Başbakanımız, bugün biz, ifade ettik. Kendileri de Belçika hukuk sistemi içinde karşılaştığı zorluklardan bahsetti. Ama bu beklentimiz geçerliliğini sürdürmektedir ve bunun takipçisi olmaya devam edeceğiz.

KONUK BAKAN: Yesterday I had a chance to explain in very clear words, that I understand the frustration about this issue. This being said, you should not forget that about 700 questions from the Turkish side are formulated each and every year for collaboration on very concrete judicial efforts and 600 and more than that are established and are answered with a positive reaction. So it is important, when judging the cooperation between two countries, not to point out the only one, which is of course a very specific and a very delicate point; and think that this stands for the whole of the cooperation between two countries.

The second point I want to make is that, the inquiry in the case of which you speak, has gone on and probably in the weeks to come, it will come to a trial. This being said, it is clear that Fehriye Erdal is not in custody today. That is the truth of the matter. It is the result of choices that are made by the judiciary branch of power, on which we believe in the separation of powers. I think you mentioned we have a difficulty, but that’s not a difficulty. In our view of the rule of law, separation of powers is essential. And it is essential that governments and ministers do not decide what the judges can do or not do. So if a judge chooses to give somebody who is in an inquiry, the freedom of movement, than it is the decision on which the executive branch has no comments to be made. That is very important for us. And of course one can regret the consequences of some of these decisions -that is very fine and especially journalists have all the right to comment on these issues- but for us it is quite essential. So I have two things to say. Do not forget the separation of powers in my country and secondly do not judge the willingness of Belgian judiciary and Belgian government to work alongside with the Turkish judiciary and the Turkish government in order to fight against terrorism. Do not judge that on one issue alone.

SAYIN BAKANIMIZ: Just to add one more, of course we do not judge as Turkey and there is a good cooperation between the two executive powers. But it is essential for us to expect that such a terrorist would be arrested and taken to the court based on the principles of fight against terrorism. It is essential to fight against terrorism. That is very important for us.

KONUK BAKAN: You saw, we had a frank discussion.

SAYIN BAKAN: Thank you.